The Paet-Ashton Transcript


Eric Zuesse, 3 Feb. 2015

Here is a complete transcript of the extraordinarily revealing phone conversation, that occurred on 26 February 2014, in which the foreign-affairs chief of the European Union, Catherine Ashton, was informed by her investigator, Urmas Paet, into his findings regarding what had been the cause of the violence that brought down the Ukrainian Government of President Viktor Yanukovych — whether it was Yanukovych himself, or the people who had opposed Yanukovych and who had supported Ukraine’s joining the EU (which Yanukovych had finally decided not to do). 

This conversation makes absolutely clear that the EU had not participated in bringing down Yanukovych and was shocked to learn that Yanukovych had not been behind the violence on that historic occasion, which had occurred only days prior.

This conversation goes by so fast so that a transcript of it is really necessary, in order for one to be able to absorb the full import of what’s happening and being revealed in it. Consequently, what now follows will be the transcript of this entire astounding phone call, with explanatory notes added in brackets by myself, for the reader’s comprehension of what was being referred to by these officials, in this phone-call that shows the truly astonishing extent of U.S. President Barack Obama’s depravity — a depravity that clearly shocked these EU officials, even while they seemed to have been resigned to it. (Subsequently, they went along with it, with only weak ongoing resistance to it.)

Estonia’s Foreign Minister Urmas Paet phones the EU’s foreign-affairs chief Catherine Ashton, to report on the findings of his February 25th inquiry for the EU, into the situation in Ukraine right after the coup that had just overthrown Ukraine’s democratically elected (in 2010) President Viktor Yanukovych:




good afternoon madame. 

this is again the center action service …

should we go, do you think it is going to be possible straight away?

to connect Mr. Katz … yes sir.

so please go on, I’m connecting with the Lady Ashton cabinet.

yes thank you.

you’re welcome.


yes hello this is Mian speaking.

yes it is for the conference with the Estonian foreign minister, they are online.


yes hello can you put me through please?

yes i’ll connect you to Mr. Katz, one moment.

thank you.

hello minister.


hi I’ll put you through, thank you very much.

thank you.






hello how are you?

I am fine.

good. I’m good.

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and you?

good. I just wanted to catch up with you on what you thought when you were there.

yes, I returned last night already, so that I was one day.

yes. Impressions?

Impressions are sad. I met with representatives of Regions Party [the Party of the just-ousted President Yanukovych], also new coalition representatives, and also civilian society, there is this lady called Olga, who is head of the doctors, yes, you know her.

yes, I do,

so that yes, whew, my impression in this is sad, that there is, well, no trust, that there was the sense that there was those politicians who will return now to the coalition, well, people from Maidan [the anti-Yanukovych demonstrators] and from civilian society [non-governmental leaders in Ukraine], they say they know everybody who will be in your [whatever the Maidaners install as constituting the new] government, and all these guys have dirty past [i.e., even the Maidan leaders know that everyone who stands even a chance to be installed into the new government has a “dirty past”] 


so that they, well, they made some proposals to this same Olga and to others from civilian society, that they join new government, but this Olga, for example, says directly that she’s ready to go [in]to the government only in the case if she can take with her her team, call in experts to start real healthcare reforms, so that, oh, basically that the trust level is absolutely low; on the other hand all the security problems, the (inaudible) problems, Crimea, all this stuff, Regions Party was absolutely upset, they say that well they accept this now, that there will be new government and there will be external [for-Yanukovych’s-replacement] elections, but there is enormous pressure against the members of parliament [from his Regions Party], that there are uninvited visitors [Ukrainian nazis] during the night, to [Regions] Party members, well, journalists, some journalists who were with me, they saw during the day that one member of parliament was just beaten in front of the parliament building, by these guys with the guns on the streets [the highly organized Ukrainian nazis, beating those Parliamentarians, to terrorize them into not resisting the coup], 


so that all these messages is still there, and of course this Olga and others from civilian society, they were absolutely sure that people will not leave the streets before they see that the real reforms will start, so that it is not enough that there is just change of government.  [He now changes totally to what the EU’s and his own country’s leaders care the most about, which isn’t at all “she can take with her her team, call in experts to start real healthcare reforms,” but instead:] There is the main impression, so that from EU’s and from Estonia’s perspective of course, they should be ready to put this financial package together [for their aristocrats’ Ukrainian bondholders], also together with others, this very clear message is needed that it’s not enough that there is a change of government, that the same real reforms, re. an election, to increase the level of trust [is needed], otherwise it will end badly [those loans won’t be repaid]. Because the Regions Party [the people now afraid] also said that then you will see that if the people from the eastern part of Ukraine [which they represent] will really wake up, and start to demand their rights [as the Maidaners in the west had been demanding theirs], some people with me were in Donetsk [in the east] their people said, well we can’t wait, how long still the occupation of [by] Ukraine lasts in Donetsk [i.e., they were already so alienated by rule from the west so that, even under Yanukovych, they considered it to be “occupation”], that it is real Russian ship city and we’d like now to see that Russia will take over [and any such breakaway would remove from Ukraine assets that otherwise could be available to pay back EU loans]. So that those are [my] short impressions.

Now very very interesting. I’ve just had a big meeting here with Olli Rehn and the other [EU] commissioners. We are working on financial packages, short, medium, long term, everything from how we get money in quickly, to how we can support the IMF [guarantor of international loans], and how we can get the kind of investment packages and business leaders, and so on. On the political side, we’ve worked out resources we’ve got and I offered to civil society and to Yatsenyuk [the banker whom Obama’s agent was now actually choosing to run the country] and Klitchko and everybody I met yesterday, we can offer you people who know how to do political and economic reform [i.e., to make whole the bond-bets of Europe’s aristocracy]. the countries that are closest to Ukraine have themselves been through dramatic changes, and have done big political and economic reform, so we’ve got loads of experience to give you, which we have to give. I said to the people in Maidan, yes, you want real reform, but you’ve got to get through the short term first, so you need to find ways in which you can establish a process that will have anti-corruption at its heart [this need reflecting the interests of both Europe’s aristocrats who have loaned money to Ukraine, plus of the Ukrainian public, so that Ukrainians won’t continue to be robbed blind by Ukraine’s own oligarchs — benefiting both the EU’s aristocracies plus the Ukrainian public], that will have people working alongside until the elections, and that you can be confident in the process. I said to Olga, you may not be health minister now, but you need to think about becoming health minister in the future, because people like you are going to be needed to be able to get to make sure that things will happen. But I also said to them, if you simply barricade the buildings now, and the government doesn’t function, we can’t get money in, because we need a partner to partner with [in order to get those European loans paid back]; and I said to the opposition leaders, shortly to become government, you need to reach out to Maidan, you need to be, you know, engaging with them; you also need to get ordinary people back on the streets under a new sense of their role, so that people feel safe. I said to the Party of Regions [Yanukovych’s] people, you have to go and lay flowers where the people died, you have to show that you understand what has happened here, because what you are experiencing was anger, of people who have seen the way that Yanukovych lived and the corruption, and they [Ukrainians] assume you’re all the same; and those are the people who’ve lost people, and who feel that he [Yanukovych] ordered that to happen; there’s quite a lot of shock, I think, in the city, a lot of sadness and shock, and that’s going to come out in some very strange ways if we’re not careful. I think all of this we’re going to have to work on. We’ve done a big meeting here today, to try to get this in place. But yes, it’s very interesting, your observations.

It is, and actually the only politician the people from civilian society mentioned positively was Poroshenko [who was soon to become the ultimate winner in the May 25th Presidential “election,” which was held only in Ukraine’s northwest, because by then the regime’s massacres of people in the southeast had already begun and so the residents there knew that they didn’t want to be ruled any longer from Kiev], so that he had some so to say trust among all these Maidan people and civilian society; and [NOW COMES THE BOMBSHELL] second, what was quite disturbing, the same oligarch [Poroshenko — and so when he became President he already knew this] told that well, all the evidence shows that the people who were killed by snipers, from both sides, among policemen and people from the streets, [this will shock Ashton, who had just said that Yanukovych had masterminded the killings] that they were the same snipers, killing people from both sides [so, Poroshenko himself knows that his regime is based on a false-flag U.S.-controlled coup d’etat against his predecessor]

Well, that’s yes, …

So that and then she [Dr. Olga Bolgomets] also showed me some photos, she said that as medical doctor, she can, you know, say that it’s the same handwriting, the same type of bullets, and it’s really disturbing that now the new coalition that they don’t want to investigate, what exactly happened; so that now there is stronger and stronger understanding that behind the snipers, it was not Yanukovych, but it was somebody from the new coalition. [Notice here that Paet had tactfully avoided saying that Ashton’s assumption that it had been Yanukovych was false; instead, he totally ignored her having said that, and he here simply said that the evidence went totally the opposite direction, the direction that Poroshenko himself knew to be true.] 

I think that we do want to investigate. [That sentiment on her part lasted about one second.] I mean I didn’t pick that up, that’s interesting. Gosh? [Ashton here seemed to have felt embarrassed, and she thus ended in a “Gosh” that was almost inaudible, as if a question, and then she proceeded simply to ignore this crucial matter entirely. All of the evidence suggests that she was exceedingly reluctant to believe that the bad guys here had actually been on the anti-Yanukovych side. She didn’t want to believe that, perhaps because her supreme priority was getting Europe’s loans paid back.]

So that it was in this instance disturbing that if it’s us now to live its own life very powerfully, then it already discreditates from the very beginning also this new coalition.

[At this point, Ashton noticeably jerks the topic back to the needs of her own sponsors, Europe’s lenders to Ukraine, who want to be paid back; and she suddenly sours on Olga, as being “not a politician.”]

I mean this is what we’ve got to be very careful of as well, that they need to demand great change, but they’ve got to let the Rada [Parliament] function. If the Rada doesn’t function, then we’ll have complete chaos. [Ashton clearly wants now to sweep those bullets and blood under the rug.] So, being an activist and a doctor is very important, but it means you’re not a politician, and somehow they’ve got to come to a kind of accommodation for the next few weeks, as to how the country’s actually going to run, and then we get the elections and things can change. And that’s, I think, going to be quite pop[ular]. I’m planning to go back early next week, hoping on Monday [and the end of the conversation discusses the big EU names who will be coming to Ukraine the next week]. 

The remainder of the call consists of pleasantries.

This phone-conversation reveals that:

1: Ashton was authentically ignorant of the long-organized Obama operation, which had been prepared in conjunction with far-rightwing and rabidly anti-Russian politicians in other countries, especially in Poland, to plan this coup (and the secret training in Poland of Ukrainian nazis was intensive and was perfectly designed for the coup that unfolded just five months later in Kiev; so, this was, indeed, a very skillful operation), and also with the cooperation of Israel’s far-right. This international operation was organized by the CIA, so skillfully that even Cathy Ashton and Urmas Paet knew nothing of it in advance.

2: As the numerous videos, of the coup itself, document, it was a brilliant “false flag” operation, which fooled even Ashton and Paet as to who was “behind the snipers.” This was international intrigue of the very highest order.

3: Even after Ashton learned that she had been fooled, she continued unwaveringly on, promoting the interests of her bondholders, even though she now knew (or had been authoritatively informed by Paet) that the entire operation was profoundly corrupt, and even though she had earlier prettified her concerns as urging “a process that will have anti-corruption at its heart.” (And note also that she said this after Paet had already informed that “all these people have dirty past.”) Although (unlike Obama) she didn’t want to continue (if not indeed to intensify) Ukraine’s legendary corruption, she chose to do that when she felt that it would be necessary in order for her bondholders (basically via the IMF) to get paid back. It would now be a battle over Ukraine’s assets, between Europe’s aristocrats, versus Russia’s aristocrats: an international bankruptcy-proceeding, to be determined militarily between NATO versus Russia, not by any international bankruptcy court of law. This is a bare-knuckle international battle between aristocracies: that’s what this is really all about.

4: Now we know what Victoria Nuland was referring to when she said “F–k the EU!” Ashton and Paet are more concerned about the interests of their mega-investors than about the lives of any Ukrainians, but aren’t (as Nuland was) eager for Ukraine’s nazis to run that country and to become the people who would bring Ukraine into the EU. They don’t want that (they had had enough of Hitler, and also of Mussolini). Obama clearly does: he craves Ukraine in NATO; that’s why he installed this government. And all of this happened barely two months after Nuland had told a group of extremist right-wingers, with proud satisfaction, that, “We have invested more than five billion dollars to help Ukraine to achieve these and other goals,” which she euphemistically called “democracy” (which Ukraine actually already had, before the U.S. Government took them over and placed nazis and other fascists in charge there, but which democracy Obama didn’t like there; so, he ended it and started his ethnic cleansing to get rid of the voters he didn’t want to be there; he used the local nazis to do precisely that; that’s why he chose them to rule there).

The United States Government wants control of the land there, not of the people there; but, in order to do that, and to “make it stick” (so that no other Ukrainian leader like Yanukovych, who was not controlled from Washington, would be elected to lead Ukraine) the people in the region that had voted 90% for Yanukovych need first to be eliminated: either by killing them, or else by causing millions of them to flee into adjoining Russia — both of which are happening.


Investigative historian Eric Zuesse is the author, most recently, of  They’re Not Even Close: The Democratic vs. Republican Economic Records, 1910-2010,  and of  CHRIST’S VENTRILOQUISTS: The Event that Created Christianity.

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