April 19, 2015
By Joanna Stanislawska
Translated from Polish by J.Hawk
“Maidan was also our operation. The snipers were trained in
Poland. These terrorists shot 40 demonstrators and 20 police officers on the
Maidan in order to provoke riots,” – said the EU Parliament Deputy and
presidential candidate Janusz Korwin-Mikke.
JKM: Poland does not have a conflict of interests with
Russia. We have no problems on the Polish-Russian border. Fostering a
militaristic state of mind is not useful to us, only to the US. It’s hard to
agree with people like Vladimir Zhirinovskiy, since he is crazy, but he is fair
to call us as Washington’s stooges.
Wirtualna Polska: But such sentiments are only natural given
Russia’s aggressive policies. It’s difficult to ignore Iskander missiles on our
JKM: Just a second! The Iskanders appeared there only
recently, after Poland launched a hundred brutal verbal assaults on Russia, and
after US armored cavalry paraded on Polish territory. I am a poker player, and
in poker one has to think like the opponent. From Russia’s perspective, the
situation looks as follows: in the last twenty years NATO had swallowed up the
German Democratic Republic, Poland, Czech Republic, Slovakia, Hungary,
Lithuania, Estonia, Romania, Bulgaria, and wants to lay its paws on Ukraine.
Moreover, they tore Kosovo away from Serbia, attacked Muammar Qaddafi (may he
rest in peace), and now are attacking the only defender of Christianity in
the Middle East, His Excellency Bashar al-Assad, only because they are Russia’s
allies. One can find an internet meme which says “Russians want war. Look how
they placed their country close to NATO bases.” So I’m asking, who’s the
Wirtualna Polska: The Ukrainians might have a different view
on this matter.
JKM: Unfortunately they can thank the Americans for all
that. Russia had a fairly friendly president in Ukraine in the person of Mr.
Viktor Yanukovych. And Russia had no intention of taking anything away. It was
also the ideal situation for us, because it is in Poland’s interest for Ukraine
to exist as an independent state, but also a weak one. That’s what Maidan
destroyed. US State Department official Victoria Nuland openly admitted that
the US spent $5 billion to destabilize the situation in Ukraine. We are dealing
with US aggression in Ukraine. Putin is only pulling chestnuts out of the fire.
Wirtualna Polska: But that’s the money that the US had spent
since 1991 to democratize Ukraine. They were not spent to organize the Maidan.
Do you believe that it was a CIA operation?
JKM: Yes—and it was also our operation. The snipers were
also trained in Poland. Even Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung already wrote who
was really shooting on the Maidan. The terrorists had shot 40 demonstrators and
20 police officers in order to provoke riots. The truth is finally coming
WP: Why would Poland want to train those, as you call them, “terrorists”?
JKM: Let me say this again: we are doing a favor to
Washington [J.Hawk note: JKM here is making a play on words, because the word “favor”
is only one letter away from “blow-job”, which was the word used, and also with
reference to Washington, by the former Polish Foreign Minister Sikorski who
complained Poland is not getting sufficient appreciation from the US.]
WP: Fine, but do you have any proof?
JKM: I sit in the EU Parliament next to Mr. Urmas Paetz, the
Minister of Foreign Affairs of Estonia who acknowledged in a telephone
conversation with Baroness Catherine Ashton that it was “our people” who shot
on the Maidan, and not Yanukovych’s people, or Putin’s people. Trained by us,
in Western countries.
WP: I don’t know what Paetz and Ashton talked about, but
Putin certainly said this. You are repeating Russian propaganda theses. It’s
difficult to consider as consistent with Poland’s national interest.
JKM: His Excellency Vladimir Putin said it two months after
Mr. Paetz. I believe in St. Augustine’s principle, “may the world perish, but
justice must be done.” If the Russians, through the mouth of Sergey Lavrov, say
that they did not violate the Budapest Memorandum, they are lying like dogs,
but when they are right, we have to acknowledge it.
WP: NATO has a defensive doctrine, while Putin is arming on
a massive scale, is sending tanks and heavy equipment to Ukraine, and you claim
this is not an aggressive policy?
JKM: What NATO? The Americans! War is useful only from the
American point of view. There are interest groups in the US which are pushing
for armed conflict: defense industry, financiers, some politicians, generals,
but also many people (some of whom I know personally) from among the
neoconservatives. They are analyzing the situation with cold logic: we have
built the mightiest army in the world, but we also have 14 trillion dollars in
debt, and we can’t afford further development. China, which supports Russia,
will soon overtake us, therefore if we are to preserve our global hegemony, we
have to start a war, in a few years at the latest. Ukraine is a very convenient
pretext. At present time Poland is in a position to prevent World War III.
WP: In what way?
JKM: By declaring neutrality when it comes to Ukraine. Like
Slovakia, Hungary, Romania, and Belarus, which don’t take part in the
anti-Russian frenzy. We might save the world if we deprive the US Army from
access to Ukraine.
WP: The Kremlin occupied Crimea, and through the pro-Russian
separatists it is lawlessly occupying the Eastern Ukraine, but we are supposed
to say that nothing happened?
JKM: The Crimean situation is clear. Russia used the Kosovo
precedent. Because why can one tear Kosovo away from Serbia, but can’t tear
Crimea away from Ukraine? The Russians warned that whoever recognizes Kosovo’s
independence gives assent to similar situations in the future. The Donbass is
not as obvious, but here Ukraine made a mistake. It should have given up Crimea
and placed its military on the border with Russia. Instead it began to scream,
but the effect of screaming was that it lost Crimea regardless, while the
inhabitants of the Donbass felt that they might succeed too.
WP: So we should have left Ukraine to its own devices?
JKM: It makes no difference to Poland whether Ukraine has
Crimea and Donbass or not. We also have to remember that any help to Ukraine is
help to people who, at least in Western Ukraine, hate us. Their heroes are
Stepan Bandera and Roman Shukhevych who are responsible for the genocide of
Polish civilian population in Podolia, Volhynya, and Eastern Little Poland,
where up to 100 thousand were killed. Those are fascists.
WP: Once again you are repeating Russian propaganda.
JKM: You have to admit that the Russians have a point when
using the term “fascists” to describe, for example, the Right Sector. His
Excellency Vladimir Putin should be thanked for one thing: thanks to his
actions, the Ukrainians had begun to hate Russians more than Poles.
WP: Why do you believe that Putin would be a great president
JKM: Because he is strong and decisive. The more unhappy
they are with him in Europe, the better president he is from Russia’s point of
view. We also need a president whom our neighbors would fear.
WP: Might Warsaw be hit with nuclear weapons?
JKM: I doubt Putin would use nuclear weapons against a
country that does not have them and which does not threaten Russia. There is no
such risk, in this matter Putin is entirely rational.
J.Hawk’s Comment: This is part of a longer interview dealing
with a whole range of issues—the translation above covers only parts relevant
to Russia and Ukraine. I should also note that Janusz Korwin-Mikke was one of
the first Polish politicians to openly state that the CIA was operating a torture
site on Polish soil, something that the Polish government strenuously denied—until
the US itself acknowledged it. Will the “Maidan sniper” story follow a similar